Dr Khir Toyo’s comments on the “Allah issue”
by lilian ~ May 11th, 2008
The below are quotes taken from former Menteri Besar Dr. Khir Toyo. He has been known to stoke racial (and now religious) unease through his blog post. Sometime back, I had voiced my dissatisfaction on Khir Toyo’s views on the pig’s farming in Selangor.
Now, his views on the use of the term “Allah” is yet another very worrying thoughts. This is just my opinion. I shall not argue with the points as the matter is now with our Malaysian’s courts. There are many wise opinions on the history, background and reasons why other faiths use the term “Allah”.
Islam tidak mengiktiraf agama lain sebagai agama yang benar. Kita sebagai umat Islam juga perlu menolak pluralism atau kepelbagaian dan kesamarataan semua agama. Namun Islam tidak pernah menghalang agama lain diamalkan.
I think it is very immature to say that the purpose of the mubaligh (missionaries) usage of Allah is to confuse the young generations of Malays. This reflects the very close-minded view of a person. Our youths, regardless of races or religions are now exposed to many other elements like porn, drugs and other immoral acts in their every day life due to the easy availability of the internet.
So, are we going to insult our youths that they are mere sponges who absorb every single thing they are exposed to? As a parent to teenagers, I think my sons will froth in the mouth if I tell them that they should stay way from idolism (of people), materialism, the MTV, Animax, porn channels (not that they are addicts to them) and other things which in a nutshell are seen as ‘bad elements’ in any religious faith.
But I don’t do that. I give them the basic foundation of our Christian faith, leave them with all the good and bad elements and choices out there and yet, I do not have to worry. Because our children are not sponges and they are not stupid.
How can we adults think that the younger generation can be as naive as to think that by the mere change of the term, they get confuse?
Apakah tujuan desakan untuk menukar perkataan tuhan kepada perkataan Allah oleh mubaligh Kristian? Sebagai orang Islam saya melihat ada tujuan pihak tertentu dalam jangka masa akan datang untuk mengelirukan generasi muda Melayu.
Apakah akan terjadi jika anak-anak muda kita nanti mendapat risalah Kristian dalam bahasa Melayu menggunakan perkataan Allah sebagai ganti tuhan mereka? Bukankah ini merupakan cara halus untuk melanggar Perlembagaan yang melarang sebarang dakwah agama lain ke atas umat Islam?
.....post continues after advertisement
Therefore, Dr Khir, I think it is a very weak argument to use the reason - “Christian missionaries’ intention of using the term “Allah” is to subtlety convert Malay youths to Christianity. Please do not insult their intelligence. Even my five years old son knows that we believe in Jesus as the Son of God. But do you think, Muslims children would do that? Don’t you think that Muslim parents would have taught their own children what Islam is? By the time a child can read the name Allah, I am sure they would have known their basic religious teachings.
Apakah akan terjadi jika anak-anak muda kita nanti mendapat risalah Kristian dalam bahasa Melayu menggunakan perkataan Allah sebagai ganti tuhan mereka? Bukankah ini merupakan cara halus untuk melanggar Perlembagaan yang melarang sebarang dakwah agama lain ke atas umat Islam?
I am not against Muslims defending their need to prevent Catholics and The Herald to use the term Allah in our publication. It is the Muslims rights to do that. But this matter is now in the court and its decision is in the court. But I do feel the need to say that :
1) It is frivolous to falsely accuse Christians that we are intending to influence Malay youths;
2) It is highly dangerous to stoke these sort of tensions and raise uneasy sentiments amongst the different faiths
3) Someone in your calibre has to have more responsibilities because we know where it can lead to
4) Muslims and Christians can have open dialogues to understand both sides of the stories.
5) I think it is disgusting that we allow the God Almighty to be drawn into political matters.
6) It is despicable when one does it, i.e. to drag God into an argument/mission for personal glory.
All the above opinions are strictly mine alone. Although I belong to the Roman Catholic church and profess my belief in God and Jesus is His Son and I have the Holy Spirit (Roh Kadus) as my guide and counsellor, this posting is just a personal views and do not represents the Catholic Church or Christianity.
We Christians are taught to speak up but do it without hurting others feelings and false accusations are frowned upon by God. “Thy will be done, on earth as in heaven.” Amen.
All quotes taken from Dr Khir Toyo’s blogpost with this URL: http://www.drkhir.com/2008/05/islam-dicabar-menang-sorak-kampung.html
- Christian Bible in Bahasa Melayu NOTE : Before I proceed, let me put another reminder that this is a personal blog of a Catholic
- High Court to hear case over use of the word ‘Allah’ (The Star) - The Archbishop of Kuala Lumpur Most Rev Datuk Murphy Pakiam will make an appearance at the High
- Bahasa Malaysia Bible For those who are interested to see the Bible written in several Malaysian languages, please check out the Bible
- Of money, food and God I have blogs on the above issues like money, food and God. And maybe I can lump my personal
- Replying to the comments from a Muslim I have a few comments which I am going to try to give my views as an individual. It
- The Herald vs. the Government of Malaysia on the use of the term Allah I have been waiting and anticipating for something positive. We are asked to pray over this matter and I
- Answering Jacknaim’s questions I very much welcome Jacknaim's comments on this blog because it is rare that I get Muslims who are open
May 11th, 2008 at 9:59 am
[...] Khir Toyo Posted on 09:58, May 11th, 2008 by Lilian makes me speechless Popularity: unranked [?]On this day years ago..To adsense or not to adsense… - 2005If I could [...]
May 11th, 2008 at 11:07 am
4) Muslims and Christians can have open dialogues to understand both sides of the stories.
i once had organized interfaith dialog at my campus. Guest what, the christian society boycott it. they even called the pastor not to come as a panelist. Luckily the pastor is a very good man and he came even though someone tried to stopped him.. Then we got message from christian saying that they will not going to join any dialog involving islam-christian because they will lose via argument and they
only win through god’s love
May 11th, 2008 at 11:53 am
:X i wander which big stone this bugger burst out from. haven’t he heard of the inter-faith activities. aduh. pengsan.
May 11th, 2008 at 11:25 pm
Apakah tujuan desakan untuk menukar perkataan tuhan kepada perkataan Allah oleh mubaligh Kristian?
Hello, we are not changing the word Tuhan to Allah. We have been using both words as in
Allah = God (God head)
Tuhan - refers to Jesus (Tuhan Yesus)
Roh Kudus - Holy Spirit
It is that simple.
May 12th, 2008 at 11:24 am
Jane/froginkl - This is one of the most irresponsible politician who enjoys stirring up negative sentiments for his own gain. I wonder how he remains as MB for that long. He is trying to show off he got guts so that he can garner more votes in the coming UMNO election.
Jacknaim - Sadly, what they said is true. If we Christians uttered anything in similar veins, we can get into really deep trouble. Even if we don’t say anything, we still get it. Remember the group of Muslims protesting in Silibin Perak Catholic church? No dialogues, no questions, they straight away go and protest. Lucky the Catholic church was calm about it and carried on what they were doing without fuss while those people outside were there.
May 12th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
Thanks for posting ur opinions on this. It is such a shame that we have people like Dr Khir (doctor somemore) who are stroking divisive propaganda when most Malaysians are moving forward towards unity and a stronger national identity.
Keep it up!
May 12th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
i think discussion is the best method. we better find the similarities compared to differences between us then only we caN LOVE EACH OTHER.
Say: “O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah.” If then they turn back, say ye: “Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah’s Will).[3:64]
May 12th, 2008 at 6:07 pm
Lilian, this good for nothing fucker is only good for stirring up trouble!
The end of BN is nigh and even its component parties are fucking them for getting them into hot water.
Very soon BN will be history!
May 13th, 2008 at 12:16 am
Lilian, re your note above. thanks for your info. As I may have mentioned, I am new in this blogging site and only just recently got interested in Malaysian politics which I’ve neglected for so long. Coming back to Dr. Khir ….?
He cited the following:-
Apakah akan terjadi jika anak-anak muda kita nanti mendapat risalah Kristian dalam bahasa Melayu menggunakan perkataan Allah sebagai ganti tuhan mereka? Bukankah ini merupakan cara halus untuk melanggar Perlembagaan yang melarang sebarang dakwah agama lain ke atas umat Islam?
Just exactly what is he afraid of? Our scripture says, if “God is for us, who can be against us?” I believe it applies to all God’s creation - Bhuddhist, Hindu, Christians, Muslims etc… And also doesn’t Dr Khir know that for every pamphlet (risalah) we Christians distribute such as informing about seminars, we are required to print on them “Not for Muslims”?
And, we don’t make formal complaints against those things we can tolerate such as removing crosses and so on. The recent one not allowed to use the word “Allah” is just too much in my opinion since we have been using it since the last century. Imagine all our children’s books, Bibles in Bahasa Malaysia and other literature have to be re-written because the word “Allah” have to be deleted from them all. Incidentally, if that were to happen, what Malay word are we going to use to replace the word “Allah”? I hate to say this but may be we’ll have to pray and ask God what word we shall use since certain creation of His don’t want to share the word (the very word created by Him - everything belongs to Him) with others. Praise the Lord.
May 13th, 2008 at 2:14 am
For me, i’m not against you christian use the word of Allah if it refers ti the almighty god. However, i did go to protestant church to learn more about christianity(not that i want to convert but to understand u all) but when they sing the song in bahasa, they use the word TUHAN and not ALLAH just like u mention. it’s even in the hymn manual book that the word is TUHAN. hope u dont mind to explain it to me. sorry but i’m just a curious guy. hope u all x mind to entertain my question
May 14th, 2008 at 2:22 pm
Sorry if i use hardword.. im not so good in English..
From my oppinion Using the word Allah is ur business.. But as long as it happen in Malaysia, by doing that will give the wrong meaning to Allah base on our different belive and we as muslim have right to fight against it. Allah have been stated in Quran and we are muslim worship to Him as the one and only god in universe.
Dont have son and dont have same kind with others.
From what base Cristians want to claim to use that name since it never stated in bible before.. even in hebrew language.
Is it same like U use other religion god name like Zeus, Amon, Buddha, Rama? Why not just use that name.
I want to know what the reason you want to use the name of Allah for your god. Why now and whoy not before. And why dont you just convert to Islam to be the servant of the real Allah.
If u fight to use Allah it will make havoc untill everybody wanna claim their Allah is right which is never happen before bcoz we muslim dont bother who you want to worship. And if you think muslim dont mind and glad that you worship to Allah is wrong because you spread the wrong teaching about Allah the Almighty God. This is my point of view as a muslim and that the answer why dont like it and against it. Wallahualam..
May 14th, 2008 at 2:53 pm
Faizan - Like I mentioned in my previous post, the matter is between The Herald (a private circulation weekly) and the Malaysian Government which will be handled by the court. So, I shall not get involve.
However, can I point out to you that the word Allah has been used since the 1800 and not 2008? Please do not be misled that this is just a recent occurrence. Catholics did not just come up with this idea in 2008 to use Allah. It has been used for more than a century. However, politicians are using for the political reasons.
Allah is used in the Bahasa Malaysia version of the Bible. East Malaysians use Bahasa Malaysia to worship and pray. I cannot say for sure in which context because even in our English Bible, we refer to God in many terms like Yahweh, Lord, God and Almighty.
I am trying to get my hands on the Bahasa Malaysia Bible so that I can help to clear some of these misunderstandings. Do not be fearful, we are not ’stealing or grabbing’ the term from anyone. After all, we are praying to the same God. The Jews, the Christians and you. It is a fact.
Please note that this is just a personal blog of a Catholic and I do not represent the Catholic faith, the court case nor Christians in whole.
May 16th, 2008 at 10:00 pm
[...] then, there is the former MB’s blog posting regarding the use of the term Allah which I find to be frivolous [...]
May 17th, 2008 at 7:18 am
Lilian, Allah itu Satu, tiada dua atau tiga…hanya Allah yang berhak disembah, bukan Jesus Al-Masih [Isa Al-Masih] atau Mary [Mariam], kata Faizan, kalau Kristian hendak gunakan nama Allah dalam upacara keagamaan, kenapa tidak memeluk Agama Islam? memang tepat pandangan yang Faizan beri,…tapi macam mana dengan Kristian? Ianya satu perubahan yang agak drastik dan mungkin mendatangkan kacau bilau apabila penganut Kristian yang taksub membuat bantahan. Hanya Allah sahaja yang Maha Mengetahui segala sesuatu kejadian itu.
May 17th, 2008 at 10:37 am
[...] Comment #1 Lilian, Allah itu Satu, tiada dua atau tiga…hanya Allah yang berhak disembah, bukan Jesus Al-Masih [Isa Al-Masih] atau Mary [Mariam], kata Faizan, kalau Kristian hendak gunakan nama Allah dalam upacara keagamaan, kenapa tidak memeluk Agama Islam? memang tepat pandangan yang Faizan beri,…tapi macam mana dengan Kristian? Ianya satu perubahan yang agak drastik dan mungkin mendatangkan kacau bilau apabila penganut Kristian yang taksub membuat bantahan. Hanya Allah sahaja yang Maha Mengetahui segala sesuatu kejadian itu. [...]
May 27th, 2008 at 9:38 pm
[...] Is it the kind of Islam which Khir Toyo prescribed to whereby he has the rights to write whatever he wants to create the misguided [...]
June 5th, 2008 at 1:21 am
Umumnya, kata “Allah” ialah kata singkatan dalam bahasa Arab bagi kata Al-ilah, yang bererti “Tuhan”. Baik orang Kristian Arab ataupun pada zaman sebelum Islam (zaman jahilliah), penyembah berhala juga menggunakan kata Ilah untuk Tuhan. Al-Kitab bahasa Arab dan bahasa Indonesia MASA KINI juga menggunakan kata “Allah“ untuk Tuhan. Penterjemahan Alkitab dari bahasa Ibrani dan bahasa yunani dipengaruhi oleh dari negara jiran dan bukannya diterjemah dari versi bahasa enggeris dalam tahun 1970an.
Ini merupakan satu mainan politik untuk mendapat sokongan yang banyak dengan taruhan yang besar dan amat bahaya iaitu mempertaruhkan nama “Allah” bagi memancing para ulama serta mana-mana persatuan agama islam dalam negara ke kancah politik kotor serta membangkitkan kemarahan orang islam itu sendiri.
Pada era 70an negara kita mengalami keadaan ekonomi yang meleset dan kejatuhan harga getah yg ketara, segelintir pemimpin yang sanggup untuk memimpin tunjuk perasaan anti-kemiskinan agar kerajaan dapat membasmi kemiskinan. Tahun 2008 ayat yang sama digunakan lagi “pembasmi kemiskinan”, dalam tahun yang sama juga harga minyak naik… rujuk Buletin Utama TV3 03 Jun 2008 bergitu juga dengan harga barang lain terutamanya beras harga pun dah naik, ini merupakan satu penindasan dan boleh dikatakan ugutan, adakah pembasmi kemiskinan itu benar? Ataupun pembasmian agama kristian keseluruahannya?? Ataupun hanya untuk kekayaan bagi satu pihak sahaja?? Kemungkinan besar semuanya boleh terjadi…. Sifat manusia memang semula jadi tidak mahu untuk menderita sengsara, semua inginkan selamat, semua inginkan kesenangan… LALAI disebabkan dunia.
[ Dari artikel di atas >> kenapa tidak memeluk Agama Islam? ] Kerana Zaman Jepun adalah sesuai untuk rakyat Malaysia, pasti bersatu padu… Lebih baik makan ubi kayu, Itu adalah Asli Jati Rakyat Malaysia.
Setiap agama di dunia ini merujuk pada perkara dan perbuatan yang baik, dan setiap manusia berpeluang untuk menganuti mana-mana agama dalam dunia ini tanpa paksaan dan ugutan. Tetapi sesetengah manusia masih lagi mempertikaikan agama ataupun bangsa lain, adakah ini caranya, etika ataupun erti kata kita beragama??
Biarkan lah manusia itu sendiri yang akan menentukan nasib mereka untuk ke Distinasi seterusnya, ke dunia??, ke n e r a k a?? Ke Syurga??? Ke perigi????… terpulanglah pada amalan di dunia ataupun kehendak seseorang tetapi janganlah jadi pembunuh!!
Persoalannya sekarang Di manakah letaknya erti kedamaian? Perlukah kita hiasi akhir zaman kita dengan tumpahan darah?
June 20th, 2008 at 11:05 am
to Jacknaim
This is a personal blog of catholic and not protestant……. I’m a catholic and so far as I know my church been using ” Allah ” word in Bahasa Malaysia long time before I was been born……. If you really want to know, try to go to a catholic church during Bahasa Malaysia mass or activities and you see that we catholic using “Allah” word as our God… Protestant and catholic have their own unique ways of praying but our believe are the same, which means that Jesus Christ are our saviour and the Son of God